A Case of Retaliation when Flagging // @steemflagrewards.
Several days ago, we good people at @steemflagrewards noticed a certain Steemian who seemed to like self-voting has own comments to the extreme.
Boasting that you are the ‘King of Spam’ really doesn’t go down very well with me or the rest of us that want the STEEM block chain to succeed.
@skreza has a decent delegation from @blocktrades and that’s not a bad thing except that he feels he needs to pay for the delegation by having a 97% self-vote percentage.
I could say the same thing for my own case. I have bought over 18000 STEEM in the last eight months so should I have a 97% self-vote too? In the world and mind of @skreza this would be perfectly justified.
He is now complaining after being put on @mack-botjr as a bad Steemian.
@mack-botjr auto-flags all his comments and posts until he is removed from the ‘bad list’.
It appears that @skreza thinks now thinks I hold the reins to the @mack-botjr; well I don’t and I can’t stop your flags coming or the @spaminator ones.
I noticed him doing some more self-voting today but also saw his percentage was now at 65%. On the back of this, I figured some progress was being made.
I sent him a comment today as you can see below and instantly got a load of abuse. My response to the abuse was not negative, simply resigned.
The next thing I see is @skreza is flagging my articles at his full weight. I don’t intend to retaliate at this moment even though I can inflict considerably more damage back if required.
@skreza seems to think I want a fight; I don’t.
With that 6,500 STEEM he could connect with people who hold the same interests, comment, vote and spread his rewards to some others who write good content.
This is a blogging platform, not a battlefield or a place to milk in the rewards if you don’t earn them.
A few more people have joined the anti-abuse incentive @steemflagrewards recently.
As the title of the post states, just be careful when flagging, pick your fights and expect retaliation from Steemians who just want to take and don’t have a giving bone in their body.
EDIT: @skreza is flagging some of the other comments. I will counter any flags he dishes out. Speak your mind whether you think he's right or wrong without fear of his flags.
If you found this article so invigorating that you are now a positively googly-eyed, drooling lunatic with dripping saliva or even if you liked it just a bit, then please upvote, comment, resteem, engage me or all of these things.
Leave him alone, he used real money to purchase that delegation.
He doesn't have to stream it into the hands of those who haven't bought.
I'm all for flagging, but sheesh... Who are you helping with this shit show?
He did, so is it OK for him to self-vote at 97%? I bought most of my STEEM, would it be OK for me to do the same or does a delegation have different rules?
How about if you have earned all that STEEM and then suddenly decided that you are now going to rape the reward pool and ignore everyone else, is that OK too?
It's a warning that's at the bottom of the post.
just be careful when flagging, pick your fights and expect retaliation from Steemians who just want to take and don’t have a giving bone in their body.
I would have let this go except for the fact that he started flagging my posts. Note, that I have flagged none of his... yet.
Thanks for your 'different' point of view. It looks like a witch-hunt, yes but the majority of the responses seem to agree that it's not OK to 'rape the pool' irrespective of how the SP and STEEM was obtained.
I preferred the community to decide, not me.
That's actually a very fair response.
One thing you may have missed was the user spamming introduction posts with "Welcome" without even having the courtesy of upvoting the OP in multiple cases.
Exhibit A
Exhibit B
Exhibit C
It would have been nice if you would have done a bit more due diligence BEFORE going up to bat for this user as then you would know they are a spammer. You're comment has the tone as if we were just antagonizing a user just for the hell of it. That's bullshit, @whatsup.
I think we have mutually exclusive ideologies. You seem to only care about money coming in. Not what kind of money or the motives behind but just any kind. Doesn't matter if the intention is to exploit or to work and build this platform into something better.
Not to say I don't value money coming in but their intentions should always be a consideration and it appears @skeza's are not oriented in a good way. Do we give them a pass because they bought a delegation?
I don't really care so much about someone wanting to be selfish with the delegation they purchase. That's their prerogative but, when they start spamming just in order to self-vote, then we got a problem.
Because you know...@mack-botjr and @themarkymark totally flag random people for fun. /s
People may complain we don't go after the big abusers, but we just don't have the SP to make much difference and could get wiped out by retaliation. Instead we work on smaller accounts who we may be able to persuade to take a less selfish path.
Unfortunately some just don't want to know. They don't understand that every user has the right and duty to have a say in where the rewards go. If everyone was greedy then the Steem platform would soon die off as the price went to nothing. The value is in making it a good place for creative people to prosper. There are cool apps being built that will bring o in the next wave, but we have to be vigilant that the abuse does not run out of control.
It's a shame that since of the vote and delegation sellers won't take some responsibility for how their services are used. I appreciate they are running businesses, but they may be harming the image of the platform they operate on.
It would be good if @blocktrades could make a comment. It is their choice, if they want to delegate to abusers, but if they are made aware it may help things.
The king of douchebags got what he wanted, a mackbot subscription is a sign that you have reached that point. It's what he wanted, so why is he complaining?
Who are those flagging you?
Another troll. Lol
At least some people are having fun at this bear market. :)
The noble chops fighting the fight for the smaller people!
It is so nice to watch you invest, engage and evolve your game here. You have been such inspirational support for so long for me personally but the greater good you do for us often goes unnoticed.
We are watching and some of us are taking notes on how to do what you did. Such a great example!
THANKS DOOD!
Not everyone thinks so zeke, I for one want this place to succeed but others just want to take and be greedy. He could do some good with his delegation, but its come to this.
I find it increasingly annoying that @blocktrades helps these people. I've also noticed some other 70 rep accounts giving votes to people we flag. I've had a few retaliatory flags from 'attempt' - but on my comments on other people's posts rather than my post.
I resisted the urge to put a sarcastic comment on his latest post telling him that's not the most effective way of upsetting someone (and in any case I use dustsweeper thus he's just wasting his VP), but like you it's easier to just let this go!
Dyou know whatever happened to the whole flag haejin thing... he's still doing his thing and no one seems to be flagging him anymore!
@blocktrades are already aware of this but wont remove the delegation. It's their choice and we cant do anything about it.
Just let it go. I posted this so the community could see what was happening. It's not just this guy but many other's we come across at SFR.
Wow, that is pretty horrible. It is too bad that people have to be like that. It's nice to see that most of the time the people don't realize they are doing something wrong and they try their best to change. Then there are cases like this where they just don't give a... I am pretty close to the point where I feel comfortable giving a delegation to SFR. Just a couple more SP!
Dear Slobberchops, I respectfully disagree. This is not supposed to be a battlefield, but it is. What was supposed to be a valid curation tool is being used by some to destroy accounts regardless of whether they abused the system or not.
One of the flaws of SFR is that you have to comment with a flag, exposing yourself to multiple counter flags should you target the wrong account. This fact alone will keep SFR membership low and abusive whales unconcerned.
To really be effective you have to stop posting and you can flag anything you want. Ahh, but you can't get rewarded for that now can you?
This is exactly what I may do at some point in the future; nothing but up votes for the ones I follow and flags for those that have irritated me up until now. No posts, no comments, no curation rewards, no quarter given and none begged.
Unfair if you can't flag back some will say. Maybe, but not less so than someone flagging with $300,000 worth of SP spread over several alt accounts which you already pointed out. This "unfairness" was deliberately built into the system so some could control their stake. To undo this, all flags should have the same weight and all this nonsense will stop when abusers have the dog shit flagged out of them as a true community effort. A curation tool is useless when 950,000+ users are afraid to use it and go inactive.
Enjoy the holidays and wishing you a happy new year!
Same weight as what? $0.01? $0.001? In that scenario, account networks such as the dart/tard group would have already won since they have 20K+ accounts. The Byteball farmers will be especially potent since they all have several hundred, if not thousands, accounts.
Even the nuisance of Steemit Defence League terrorized the crap out of people with their annoying 180+ accounts of dust votes.
On a closing note, the community flagged the crap out of Mr. Rep 83, but doing so required a consistent 2M SP on his tail. That was not going to happen. None of the whales were interested in a prolonged flagging session. There were also not enough active smaller accounts that wanted to be in the crossfire.
I get where you are coming from but I wouldn't necessarily call it a flaw as one of the functions of the comments is to provide the flagged some feedback as to why they are flagged and provide an opportunity for constructive criticism.
Of course, many abusers know exactly what they are doing and our words would essentially fall on deaf ears or worse they would flag back which does happen from time to time.
We do make it abundantly clear that we all must be wise and not target whale abusers prone to retaliate. I do think the community does need a way to collectively express their disagreement in the form of flags while minimizing the possibility of reprisal.
This could be achieved potentially by off-chain delegation mixing and a web site whereby the flags are sent with some degree of anonymity. It would be tricky to pull off but I think it could be worth it.
The alternative is to allow the often tyrannical and abusive stakeholders to continue to do what they are doing with no resistance whatsoever.
That option isn't very attractive for me.
Empowering the community with a means to assemble their disjointed stakes in solidarity against collusive voting and other activities that erode the confidence in our chain is better one for me.
It just would take a hell of a lot of work and not sure if it would be worth it. Obviously, we'll get a shit load of push back so gotta count the costs.
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"The alternative is to allow the often tyrannical and abusive stakeholders to continue to do what they are doing with no resistance whatsoever."
They are doing exactly that, ..with impunity. When discovered, they just start a new account so chances are you flagged the same individual or group repeatedly. We simply don't know who they are.
"This could be achieved potentially by off-chain delegation mixing and a web site whereby the flags are sent with some degree of anonymity. It would be tricky to pull off but I think it could be worth it."
The delegation and/or flagging could be done through sock puppet accounts if people are willing to dedicate the SP for the cause.
If the abusers use automated systems to up vote their own accounts, why doesn't SFR use the same methods to flag them? Or isn't that possible?
Thank you for your time and effort. Merry Xmas!
It's a work in progress. It is also limited by the SP available.
You see, @sadkitten used to approach it with that mindset. Unfortunately, it wasn't fruitful. Not enough people willing to let go a portion of their SP to be dedicated for flagging.
There are members of SFR that use said method to flag.
Let's bring it back to larger stakeholders. Take Mr. 83, again, in order to effectively "counter" him, the community would have to pool at least 2M SP indefinitely...and that's just to counter one individual and his 3-4 alts.
Tell you what, the last time this was attempted, it lasted about a week.
It is also important to remember that those "bad actors" you talk about tend to have many supporters. So, even in the example I provided, it's not as simple as 2M SP. It's, in fact, much greater.
Thank you for that bit of history, I wasn't aware of earlier attempts to curb the abuse this way.
Got some reading to do :)
If we could all live happily ever after wouldn't it be great? It's not going to happen though.
It was never intended to target big accounts, more educate the small and new ones. We have done this with several people now. They create an account, see trending and follow the lead, with the crap content and bid-bots. Its wrong, and we are trying to change things in our own little way.
Happy Holidays to you too!
@slobberchops can please help me and advice how to chech who is self voting anf how can i check my self voting and all this detail i dont knkw about this if you can help me. Thabk you in advance.
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I can see @daan has given you the info you need. You haven't posted in a while, and you should. The story you did 6 days ago was great. The thing is it has $12 in rewards via Bidbots. If it didn't I would give you a vote.
It's your preference to continue using them or not and for the quality of the work I see, nobody will condemn you for doing so.
They are a form of advertising and have a place here.. I suppose. From my perspective, I see $12 and say, 'how will my paltry vote make a difference to that'?
You can check your self-voting percentage on Steemworld:
https://steemworld.org/@mihirbarot
You have a self-vote percentage of 1.49 %, which is low.
So this good or bed?? Please advise.
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It's good, it means that you don't vote on your own posts a lot.
Thank you for your revert really appriciated it.
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No problem, you're doing alright, by looking at your profile, though I would personally recommend trying to post without using upvote bots that much.
It's just a personal preference though, seems like your content itself it pretty good.
Thank you for your support i am trying to learn this platform. Thnx for advise.
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You can lose support NY buying votes as many of us will not vote on posts with paid votes. Earn them instead.
I have no problem with people earning rewards and doing well on here but we have all seen how it can go too far when left unchecked. You are right to point it out to him and try to change the behaviour while he is still small. For the good of the platform users like this need to be shown that spam like that won't be tolerated. Well done for calling him out on it.
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You cant do anything about people who are getting hundreds of steem per day from self vote and multiple accounts and selling votes.. so you decided yeah why not pick this guy whose votes can gain as much as 10 cents.. you guys make me sick.
I don't ever remember any of you bitches upvoting all those creative posts I used to make before but once I start making one word comments and self vote them to recover blocktrades fees, your ass suddenly starts itching.
flagged for spam @steemflagrewards
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Oh please! 97% personal upvotes is the only sickening thing here.
We all make mistakes and learn from them if we are wise. I look forward to you seeing the error in your ways and using your influence to help.
Raping the reward pool is no way to recover from a bad trade!
Congratulations.. you all can just gang up and bully on a single me.
You called yourself the king of spam and you think you're the victim.
Who the fuck told you I'm the victim? Bitch I'm the Spam King.. and I don't give a shit to dorks
flagged for spam @steemflagrewards
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Hmm, nevermind, you didn't cry like a bitch that you're being ganged up on by bullies.
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hm , limited funds from steem reward pool .
hm , you flag someone -> steem goes back to 'steem reward pool' -> bot accounts upvote comment you left to the flagged person .
hmmmmmmmm, can we call this theft maybe ? CALL THE POLICE PEOPLE !!!!!!!
For how long have you said this? The definition of stupid.
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looks like something bothers you when law enforcement is mentioned here , good
Is that what you think, that your empty stale threats bother me?
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So you are saying you used to be a good person but nobody applauded you, now that you have committed a crime you cannot be punished?
And I am sure nobody forced you take paid delegation from blocktrades.
I am not against self-voting but please vote yourself when you make a valuable content. By voting your spam you are reducing rewards for everybody who are making quality contents and have pending rewards. So, you are hurting us.
Batman villain logic.
I won't be able to recover any cost. And so I have decided to flag self proclaimed elite bastards like you.
I'll welcome your flags. :)
Why do you think he proclaimed himself elite? Is it because next to the self proclaimed king of spam anyone who points out that their behavior is hurting others is claiming to be better than the self proclaimed king of spam?
Who the fuck are you anyway?
Not the self proclaimed retard.
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Can you point me to your 'creative posts'. I did have a look and I see nothing creative in the last 2 months. You did some things before that but I see nothing in recent times.
I'm not here to 'pick' on you at all. I give a shit about the community, and do what I can within my means.
If the small fish that are abusing are not stopped they grow to big ones and then we wont have a community left. Look at the bigger picture will you?
You are just frustrated at your self. Are you lonely? Don't have a friend?
You don't have anything concrete to say do you?
Bitch you want my attention that badly? You are annoying.
Yeah, that's what's going on here, he's desperate for your loving kindness and probably jealous of you also.
Kindly do me a favor.. take that 'jealousy' and shove it inside yr poop hole.
Do you generally think your tough guy persona means anything after making youself into such a punk? Who ARE you punking RETARD.
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yeah provide links to your Good content...
here is something extremely creative for you
Here is smidge, the idiot who thinks sfr is a sophisticated scam, making idle threats and begging people to "call the cops" on them.
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I've been dealing with these flaggers for a while now and I can assure you one thing. This flagging has nothing to do with spam, copy-past or any other crap they claim . All of us here are competing for limited funds from 'steem rewards pool' .
Flagging operation takes steem away from average users and then is channeled back to people claiming to 'fight abuse' . It is sophisticated looting operation .
They only way we can free this platform from these criminals is by getting law enforcement involved .
Lets save steem , contact FBI , IRS , Interpol .......
flagged for spam @steemflagrewards
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Lmao lol
After 2 months still spreading FUD and EMPTY THREATS. Another class A moron: Very Sophisticated Scheme.
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yeah , you have to come up with better whitewashing technique
Admitting to being a retard is effortless sometimes for retards.
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I know these modafuka very well.. they are just a bunch of shitty scammer.
pure criminals ! lets send them where they belong
When? Lmao.
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you are so deep state its ridiculous
When you nincompoop? When will you actually stop making empty meaningless threats and chasing after self proclaimed imbeciles in order to extract a semblance of agreement from and actually do something substantial instead of throwing around baseless accusations, lmao, when?
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