On one hand, I completely support the idea of a blacklist API designed to help clean up the Steem ecosystem, but the sceptic in me who challenges the status quo and questions things not as they are seen, but from alternative perspectives is concerned.
Steem is touted as this democratic free speech platform and as we've seen with Facebook deciding what content is deemed to conform to their guidelines is this not the exact same thing? You as a witness, on one hand, maintain the Steem blockchain and help process transactions, and while I realise witnesses such as yourself are more hands-on with Steem, who is policing the police here?
A theoretical for you: if for whatever reason you find yourself on one or more of these blacklists (you as in @themarkymark) because you own the tool, you could theoretically make yourself immune to being listed, right?
I am not saying that you would, I am saying that you could or am I misunderstanding how this all works? Am I correct in understanding that your API service is processing other lists and then providing a convenient wrapper service to offer a streamlined singular endpoint for blacklisted users?
What protections are in place to ensure that users are not incorrectly being added to these blacklists? Who are we to say what is content that should be penalised and what isn't? I realise spam, abuse, illegal content and plagiarism are big no-nos, but what about other forms of questionable content?
I've seen large users like berniesanders engage in flag wars with other users, all because he disagrees with them or has an agenda (sometimes it's justified).
I have also seen him recently make accusations against other users for stealing his ideas, as in he believes what he posts is unique and nobody else can post similar content (which is insane, because ideas cannot be owned and are not unique).
One man's blacklistable offence is another man's content. I think Bernie is a good example (this is not an attack on him, he is just a good example) because he has a witness account, he has a powerful personal account and numerous proxy voting accounts.
I get that the intention (at least in your eyes) is for bot owners to prevent blacklisted people using paid-for bidbots. But given this is an open platform, theoretically, there is nothing stopping non-bidbot users from using this for other purposes either.
I also realise nothing can be deleted by your API, content will always be on Steem. However, when something is flagged beyond visibility it's as good as deleted (I rarely show hidden posts when I see them).
I also have seen third-party bots that automatically flag blacklisted users, which presumably your API will be used for. So even if a user gets blacklisted and tries to redeem themselves until they're off, they'll potentially continue to be flagged. This affects your ability to grow and earn on Steem, it's censorship.
I think talking about what protections there will be against brigading and false blacklisting is definitely the next step you should take. This seems like a tool with noble intentions but goes against the ethos on the Steem brochure: a censorship resistance content platform.
Steem is touted as this democratic free speech platform and as we've seen with Facebook deciding what content is deemed to conform to their guidelines is this not the exact same thing?
These blacklists do not prevent anyone from posting anything they like. That's why it's not the same thing, and it's certainly not the exact same thing. It's not even the same ballpark. It's a lot closer to me making a post on my own website saying "The following facebook pages are crap and you shouldn't use them".
I have proven time and time again I have sacrificed profits over spam/plagiarism. In fact, there is more spam and abuse on DTube than there is with @buildawhale. Not to mention voting abuse, want to talk about that?
I run @buildawhale transparent and fair and I am extremely active preventing spam, more so than any bot owner and most any steem user on par with SteemCleaners themselves. Name any bot owner who has done 1/100th of the work in Anti-Spam than I have and I'll buy you a cookie. Every spammer I block directly affects my ability to "profit from the blockchain".
Great work. I'll be plugging the curie submission tool into this for sure to stop us submitting (or at least making us think before we submit), the users that appear on blacklists.
@themarkymark
Your contribution in your community is excellent, but a few months ago I still appear on your blacklist, I have asked for help in discord and "I do not receive an answer". I have requested that you indicate what I should do to improve my posts, and adapt it to your instructions so as not to receive the automatic message that I receive in ALL my posts, I would like to help me improve and tell me what is wrong with me. the publications.
I would appreciate getting an answer, much more if they remove me from that blacklist (do I have to pay?), Thanks.
Thank you for featuring this moderately above average post on your show. I want you to know that I no longer consider your comment as spam. Have a nice day.
He downvotes a lot (which I think is a good thing, we need more downvoting) but I don't think this was a good case to downvote. While I am not a fan of getting unrelated messages on my posts in the comments, I feel this is directly related and I believe is acceptable.
You got a 72.28% upvote from @upme thanks to @ipromote! Send at least 3 SBD or 3 STEEM to get upvote for next round. Delegate STEEM POWER and start earning 100% daily payouts ( no commission ).
i have a question
and how can you tell if your on a blacklist and how do you get off it and why is there one and if anyone that may be a control freak and decides that some one did a post that they do not like so they blacklist them for just that . and or can a person that is blacklisted appeal ,why they should not be on blacklist , if not then the blacklist is nothing more than a control freak being a abusive bully trying to censor free speech
You can query the API if you want to see if someone is on the blacklist. Getting off depends on the blacklist. The blacklists mentioned have proven they are trustworthy resources for the community.
The blacklist prevents you from using bid bots and notifies other viewers you are on the list. It does not censor anyone, even if you are flagged, your post is still visible and easily viewed. No one can remove a post from the Steem platform, not even the author.
They can delete posts, but the original transaction is still on the blockchain and can be found. Once a single upvote is on the post, they can't delete it.
I never blacklist these bots.
but you update your spam comments for $1 via @tumutanzi all day...
On one hand, I completely support the idea of a blacklist API designed to help clean up the Steem ecosystem, but the sceptic in me who challenges the status quo and questions things not as they are seen, but from alternative perspectives is concerned.
Steem is touted as this democratic free speech platform and as we've seen with Facebook deciding what content is deemed to conform to their guidelines is this not the exact same thing? You as a witness, on one hand, maintain the Steem blockchain and help process transactions, and while I realise witnesses such as yourself are more hands-on with Steem, who is policing the police here?
A theoretical for you: if for whatever reason you find yourself on one or more of these blacklists (you as in @themarkymark) because you own the tool, you could theoretically make yourself immune to being listed, right?
I am not saying that you would, I am saying that you could or am I misunderstanding how this all works? Am I correct in understanding that your API service is processing other lists and then providing a convenient wrapper service to offer a streamlined singular endpoint for blacklisted users?
What protections are in place to ensure that users are not incorrectly being added to these blacklists? Who are we to say what is content that should be penalised and what isn't? I realise spam, abuse, illegal content and plagiarism are big no-nos, but what about other forms of questionable content?
I've seen large users like berniesanders engage in flag wars with other users, all because he disagrees with them or has an agenda (sometimes it's justified).
I have also seen him recently make accusations against other users for stealing his ideas, as in he believes what he posts is unique and nobody else can post similar content (which is insane, because ideas cannot be owned and are not unique).
One man's blacklistable offence is another man's content. I think Bernie is a good example (this is not an attack on him, he is just a good example) because he has a witness account, he has a powerful personal account and numerous proxy voting accounts.
I get that the intention (at least in your eyes) is for bot owners to prevent blacklisted people using paid-for bidbots. But given this is an open platform, theoretically, there is nothing stopping non-bidbot users from using this for other purposes either.
I also realise nothing can be deleted by your API, content will always be on Steem. However, when something is flagged beyond visibility it's as good as deleted (I rarely show hidden posts when I see them).
I also have seen third-party bots that automatically flag blacklisted users, which presumably your API will be used for. So even if a user gets blacklisted and tries to redeem themselves until they're off, they'll potentially continue to be flagged. This affects your ability to grow and earn on Steem, it's censorship.
I think talking about what protections there will be against brigading and false blacklisting is definitely the next step you should take. This seems like a tool with noble intentions but goes against the ethos on the Steem brochure: a censorship resistance content platform.
Just because a person is free to post whatever they wish. Doesn't mean that we have to agree with or read what is posted if the content is crap.
We gotta keep this place a little respectable.
These blacklists do not prevent anyone from posting anything they like. That's why it's not the same thing, and it's certainly not the exact same thing. It's not even the same ballpark. It's a lot closer to me making a post on my own website saying "The following facebook pages are crap and you shouldn't use them".
Nobody owns their reputation.
He as not the guts to answer you directly. Tells a lot about this guy.
u dont have to use it.
do u want us to forbid to have a blacklist?
I wanted to comment but I have read your comment and it puts it better than I ever could write it.
I also want to add that there is a clear conflict of interest when you look at how the author of this blacklist currently profits from the blockchain.
I have proven time and time again I have sacrificed profits over spam/plagiarism. In fact, there is more spam and abuse on DTube than there is with @buildawhale. Not to mention voting abuse, want to talk about that?
I run @buildawhale transparent and fair and I am extremely active preventing spam, more so than any bot owner and most any steem user on par with SteemCleaners themselves. Name any bot owner who has done 1/100th of the work in Anti-Spam than I have and I'll buy you a cookie. Every spammer I block directly affects my ability to "profit from the blockchain".
crickets
We all profit from the blockchain.
As a witness it's marks job to try to make this place better.
Great work. I'll be plugging the curie submission tool into this for sure to stop us submitting (or at least making us think before we submit), the users that appear on blacklists.
Thank you, will implement it :) tipuvote!
:)
You've just developed another oppressive weapon to victimize and silence those who dare to challenge the status quo. Congrats.
Thank you Mark for your time and energy
This gif is always a great answer.
indeed, the guy has no arguments
@themarkymark
Your contribution in your community is excellent, but a few months ago I still appear on your blacklist, I have asked for help in discord and "I do not receive an answer". I have requested that you indicate what I should do to improve my posts, and adapt it to your instructions so as not to receive the automatic message that I receive in ALL my posts, I would like to help me improve and tell me what is wrong with me. the publications.
I would appreciate getting an answer, much more if they remove me from that blacklist (do I have to pay?), Thanks.
Awesome job! Nice Erlang/NodeJs API @themarkymark =)
PS.
I just did some blackbox testing. It could use some validation on the user name to match the rules in use on steemit.com:
http://blacklist.usesteem.com/user/[]Thanks
(reason for low repo here)
It fails gracefully on those inputs.
It certainly does =)
(reason for low repo here)
Congrats, you made the #steemitminute for today!
Click the Image Below to see the Video!
Thank you for featuring this moderately above average post on your show. I want you to know that I no longer consider your comment as spam. Have a nice day.
The fact he does a legitimate video showcasing Steem content on a daily basis and featured this post I don't see it as spam.
You make a good point. Downvote removed.
Thank you man, this guy has been down voting my stuff for awhile. I just put him on "Mute" some time ago and moved on.
He downvotes a lot (which I think is a good thing, we need more downvoting) but I don't think this was a good case to downvote. While I am not a fan of getting unrelated messages on my posts in the comments, I feel this is directly related and I believe is acceptable.
You got a 72.28% upvote from @upme thanks to @ipromote! Send at least 3 SBD or 3 STEEM to get upvote for next round. Delegate STEEM POWER and start earning 100% daily payouts ( no commission ).
Nice job!
Any kind of automatic api call to ask for "blacklist revoke" in a future?
No
Ok. Just to know, how can someone ask for it?
I have a #blacklist channel on our Discord.
i have a question
and how can you tell if your on a blacklist and how do you get off it and why is there one and if anyone that may be a control freak and decides that some one did a post that they do not like so they blacklist them for just that . and or can a person that is blacklisted appeal ,why they should not be on blacklist , if not then the blacklist is nothing more than a control freak being a abusive bully trying to censor free speech
You can query the API if you want to see if someone is on the blacklist. Getting off depends on the blacklist. The blacklists mentioned have proven they are trustworthy resources for the community.
The blacklist prevents you from using bid bots and notifies other viewers you are on the list. It does not censor anyone, even if you are flagged, your post is still visible and easily viewed. No one can remove a post from the Steem platform, not even the author.
OK AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR ANSWER and where do i find the API thing you are talking about, also and please read my last post
Look up
Authors can delete posts and comments, if they have no votes or replies. (Of course, the post operation will still be on the blockchain)
They can delete posts, but the original transaction is still on the blockchain and can be found. Once a single upvote is on the post, they can't delete it.
There is no formal process to appeal to get removed from the blacklists. I am cleared by steemcleaners but I am continuing on builawhale
Ok. Thanks 👍