The Most Voted Witnesses In The Last 3 & 6 Months! This Is What Witness Vote Expiry/Decay Would Look Like (Kinda)

in #steem6 years ago (edited)

Time for more fun Steem Stats! This time it's all about witness votes and who are the witnesses receiving the most witness votes in recent months.

This information is doubly useful, since not only does it show us which witnesses have attracted the most attention more recently, but it also shows us (roughly) what would happen if we activated a 'witness vote decay' feature.

Witness vote decay refers to the idea that witness votes could expire after a certain time period, ensuring that witness votes stay relevant and preventing, for example, whales using the blockchain, choosing witnesses and then never again returning. If whales make votes in this way and then, worst case scenario, actually die physically - then it is possible that their votes would last forever and regardless of what the witnesses do, they may stay in power!

This would be a huge problem as it would mean that the entire witness voting system would fail. There are other issues with having witness votes that never expire too. I covered some of them in previous posts about vote decay.

In any case, what we have below are two tables, each showing 100 Steem witnesses (only the 100 who last produced blocks at the time of generating the report are shown here). Each table orders the witnesses according to the value of the votes they have received ONLY during the previous 3 months (first table) and 6 months (second table). From this we get a sense of who has been active and engaging the community in some way recently vs. who has perhaps displeased the community recently or just not been so active and not received so many new votes.

Note on vote decay: If Witness vote decay were activated then this is what the witness tables might look like, but such a feature should not be enabled without giving us due notification that the votes were about to expire and allowing us to renew them in advance, so that they never actually expire if we don't want them to. Therefore, the actual final witness tables would be different to these as some percentage of the votes would be renewed. The actual end result would be somewhere in between the tables below and the current witness ranking tables visible on steemit.com and elsewhere.

Note on data: I put a couple of days of coding and testing into these tables, it is the first time I have worked with witness vote data and I found there are a few pitfalls involved with the data. I aimed to test my results by comparing them to the existing data available from @drakos' site steemian.info, however, I found a bug in the way his code was calculating the totals for proxy votes that slowed me down and caused me to scratch my head. He has now confirmed to me that this is a bug on his site and he is fixing it. I think therefore, that my data is accurate, but if you know differently then let me know in the comments and I will investigate. Thanks!

I'll be posting this data every so often and adding a page to Steem Ocean for it too if it is found to be useful.

These tables are better viewed in steempeak.com than in steemit.com as steempeak adds horizontal scrollbars to wide tables.

100 Most Voted Witnesses In The Last 3 Months


#UserVotes From Accounts (Mv)Votes From Proxies (Mv)Total Votes (Mv)Steem Power From AccountsSteem Power From ProxiesTotal Steem PowerNumber of Votes
1@abit7654.0814334.8921988.973789860.3447097813.46610887673.81470
2@wise-team8232.3519493.69917726.054076186.9584700734.0688776921.026114
3@kevinwong11765.5624698.68916464.2515825630.1642326520.9048152151.068463
4@pharesim7317.1447816.57115133.7153623029.3153870316.817493346.125684
5@steempress9759.0433932.74613691.7894832116.9991947269.8346779386.833769
6@jackmiller6509.8535568.75312078.6063223304.9892757326.2245980631.213239
7@helpie8071.8753742.75111814.6263996728.4531853195.1955849923.648406
8@themarkymark6873.6164915.19611788.8123403419.42433722.6445837142.044621
9@firepower4105.2617617.4711722.7312032689.2743771733.1535804422.427236
10@yabapmatt8222.4523466.85611689.3084071285.581716587.8895787873.4691331
11@therealwolf6639.8614976.70311616.5643287677.352464177.2745751854.6241222
12@clayop3550.2258004.18111554.4061757867.3663963210.3465721077.712653
13@reggaemuffin4989.5175713.71410703.2312470522.062829102.7035299624.763444
14@ausbitbank5616.0864659.85510275.9412780763.2262307292.5175088055.743945
15@arcange4009.2166145.92610155.1421985133.2763043109.2415028242.517901
16@drakos5100.1354276.1299376.2642525293.7812117293.1064642586.887728
17@timcliff6906.4482404.3429310.793419675.8361190491.9824610167.8181198
18@fulltimegeek6677.6382258.2388935.8763306382.671118149.6654424532.335427
19@lukestokes.mhth4155.1454314.4138469.5582057388.8292136249.1454193637.974749
20@someguy1234070.7874257.4658328.2522015619.8582108052.24123672.058797
21@bukio897.8257361.3138259.138444551.2713644899.2514089450.52259
22@blocktrades5027.6573153.0378180.6942489406.6061561202.7474050609.3531143
23@cryptopassion3356.174734.2058090.3751661782.4042344106.3654005888.769141
24@pfunk5291.9232761.9718053.8942620256.1671367569.2363987825.403712
25@utopian-io6118.5151029.3227147.8373029536.855509661.1183539197.9731117
26@cervantes6177.25881.0347058.2843058619.225436237.3713494856.596912
27@furion2981.8933833.7346815.6271476462.2051898244.5383374706.743425
28@aggroed4511.9272252.9456764.8722234046.8911115528.9183349575.8091007
29@stem.witness5896.267813.0076709.2742919492.36402554.4483322046.808211
30@gtg5778.869685.176464.0392861363.644339256.8283200620.4721630
31@smooth.witness3454.242826.1226280.3621710340.8791399333.3113109674.19699
32@anyx2826.883334.4346161.3141399708.3231651020.2073050728.53557
33@blockbrothers2838.9143161.5966000.511405666.8711565440.782971107.651270
34@patrice1486.6484488.5345975.182736102.5612222464.1232958566.684200
35@teamsteem2931.7082674.5385606.2461451613.3251324277.7012775891.026631
36@holger803619.0491904.4735523.5221791945.139942985.4412734930.58231
37@jesta4030.8191473.8565504.6751995829.647729768.9122725598.5591027
38@curie4644.935785.5685430.5032299904.671388968.032688872.7011246
39@dragosroua4625.739630.1555255.8942290400.278312016.6362602416.914258
40@steemcommunity2584.4282651.8715236.2991279660.0591313053.9152592713.974424
41@followbtcnews2916.1662200.9465117.1121443917.961089782.1012533700.061736
42@good-karma2414.3012515.184929.4811195422.9461245372.4832440795.4291470
43@roelandp4644.366238.7854883.1512299622.922118232.732417855.6521135
44@ura-soul4048.314825.4954873.8092004492.163408737.8622413230.025165
45@bhuz3510.1641245.3214755.4851738031.314616611.3522354642.666407
46@noblewitness1251.1753325.0434576.218619509.8321646370.1452265879.977230
47@partiko2073.0392423.424496.4591026449.6981199938.2912226387.989171
48@busy.witness1810.1472645.1724455.319896280.7631309737.0182206017.781793
49@ats-witness1368.3672977.8134346.18677536.7351474441.8722151978.607185
50@ro-witness3336.337787.4664123.8031651962.513389907.9332041870.446119
51@krnel3659.32365.6834025.0031811884.943181065.3831992950.326159
52@fyrst-witness897.963019.1413917.101444617.9611494904.9441939522.905172
53@rival748.6043024.373772.974370665.5531497494.251868159.803135
54@steem-bounty710.6572853.7873564.444351876.7421413031.3591764908.101277
55@justyy2431.5191113.7683545.2871203948.251551473.8081755422.059213
56@xeldal1300.6012215.1673515.768643983.0641096823.3881740806.452552
57@thecryptodrive1112.3382389.9523502.29550765.9861183366.7231734132.709567
58@netuoso2717.932585.7643303.6961345763.511290036.8031635800.314434
59@stoodkev1739.9521411.1733151.125861524.302698731.5861560255.888265
60@qurator1390.5371461.9012852.438688514.225723849.2711412363.496485
61@liondani2514.154255.4382769.5921244864.389126478.0951371342.484458
62@riverhead1870.469870.7052741.174926148.73431123.2021357271.932523
63@guiltyparties1737.006885.8462622.852860065.71438619.8141298685.524313
64@ocd-witness2277.798172.1942449.9921127834.56385260.3841213094.947380
65@markangeltrueman1635.12704.7112339.831809617.39348932.4871158549.877136
66@helo1863.66378.1692241.829922777.246187247.5461110024.79235
67@ihashfury33.572201.6492235.21916621.791090130.0911106751.88174
68@klye2148.39414.3182162.7121063761.1337089.4221070850.555104
69@delegate.lafona2008.775115.7432124.518994630.01657309.4141051939.4371
70@steemgigs2028.51758.9012087.4181004404.88529164.5751033569.46476
71@emrebeyler1604.191226.9761831.167794302.966112385.701906688.667200
72@bitrocker2020838.688957.8281796.516415269.886474261.285889531.171190
73@neoxian1556.902232.8511789.753770888.198115294.336886182.534269
74@mahdiyari1609.68150.7291760.409797021.05174632.522871653.573412
75@adsactly-witness1502.15248.2121750.362743778.185122900.416866678.601337
76@lux-witness1504.248190.4591694.707744816.98894304.197839121.18555
77@steemitboard844.626646.2631490.889418210.288319992.084738202.3722344
78@block-buster1056.009346.0661402.075522874.751171352.072694226.823121
79@steemed1210.34427.0781237.422599292.93813407.585612700.523196
80@enginewitty865.513311.5841177.097428552.118154278.442582830.56252
81@nextgencrypto894.854275.1761170.03443080.209136251.421579331.63289
82@comedyopenmic829.83736.981866.818410887.68518310.754429198.439198
83@chitty822.27732.381854.658407144.46216033.079423177.541101
84@joseph726.87100.744827.614359904.07949882.567409786.64682
85@jrswab418.29222.46640.75207113.263110149.205317262.46873
86@liberosist507.2174.758511.975251144.7042355.917253500.621102
87@b0y2k454.6824.673479.353225131.5612216.638237348.19887
88@felixxx424.1646.079430.243210021.43009.855213031.255135
89@complexring284.154100.674384.828140696.60649848.043190544.64962
90@charlieshrem333.5457.155340.7165152.3683542.947168695.31575
91@fubar-bdhr37.526265.296302.82218580.921131359.275149940.1964
92@fbslo143.55844.077187.63571081.8321824.63292906.46244
93@ety001101.01480.621181.63550016.49239918.84989935.34117
94@bobdos73.59107.636181.22636437.53853294.9289732.45834
95@aizensou141.7655.284147.04970194.12616.17172810.27183
96@danielsaori103.7265.945109.67151358.9392943.78454302.72356
97@jerrybanfield72.44524.21896.66335870.75411991.5547862.30446
98@steemychicken149.5245.9655.48424521.6432951.29427472.93792
99@cryptohazard31.8084.48336.29115749.3172219.76117969.07812
100@sc-steemit7.65307.6533789.47303789.47317

100 Most Voted Witnesses in The Last 6 Months


#UserVotes From Accounts (Mv)Votes From Proxies (Mv)Total Votes (Mv)Steem Power From AccountsSteem Power From ProxiesTotal Steem PowerNumber of Votes
1@themarkymark13733.59912400.2826133.8796800107.0946139922.71312940029.8071545
2@abit9033.26514486.79923520.0644472765.9137173049.74511645815.658844
3@jackmiller13752.5577602.24421354.8016809493.9353764204.32910573698.264454
4@reggaemuffin5945.17613830.57919775.7552943717.236848126.2129791843.4421039
5@cervantes13817.554260.02818077.5786841675.2632109326.9148951002.1772425
6@wise-team8232.6559494.01917726.6744076348.7984700905.1028777253.9114
7@pharesim8762.1488837.33217599.484338523.5754375750.5578714274.1322436
8@firepower9063.2948133.26417196.5584487634.2014027135.6818514769.882305
9@yabapmatt12583.6724182.60516766.2776230728.1182070991.2558301719.3733200
10@kevinwong11765.7994698.95116464.755825762.9292326656.6878152419.616463
11@arcange7985.1957917.40515902.63953820.2163920254.5247874074.741912
12@timcliff12265.9063619.02515884.9316073388.0351791938.1527865326.1872771
13@drakos8925.6496713.83815639.4874419480.0593324315.547743795.5991784
14@therealwolf9596.2655730.25815326.5234751531.5342837302.0137588833.5471996
15@curie11400.8753885.47615286.3515645073.491923869.677568943.163515
16@utopian-io12263.82754.77315018.5736072345.5191364009.147436354.6592710
17@clayop6068.4338605.78814674.2213004747.424261103.1887265850.6081782
18@steempress9760.533932.82413693.3544832866.5311947313.896780180.421769
19@ausbitbank7972.0075611.99813584.0053947290.3192778746.2666726036.5852617
20@bhuz4664.078574.92913238.9992309385.6474245823.3416555208.988989
21@lukestokes.mhth5878.8166465.90912344.7252910859.7263201555.0156112414.7411942
22@helpie8074.0533742.98411817.0373997817.8271853315.7625851133.589408
23@blocktrades6588.3895065.50511653.8943262200.4592508153.725770354.1792897
24@noblewitness6885.944605.07511491.0153409530.7792280174.4185689705.197550
25@followbtcnews7618.0883679.90611297.9943772049.3261822082.7325594132.0581781
26@pfunk6784.9533748.42110533.3743359528.021856007.5865215535.6061868
27@someguy1234835.7725557.89710393.6692394402.7292751958.65146361.3291963
28@patrice3307.5656340.8499648.4141637720.3593139632.5494777352.908735
29@blockbrothers4750.3134723.5779473.892352088.1862338850.1984690938.384900
30@smooth.witness4598.054669.6629267.7122276696.3052312154.4534588850.7581662
31@fulltimegeek6686.9632258.0948945.0573311008.4561118081.3144429089.77433
32@gtg7360.2791582.2098942.4883644396.978783420.9434427817.9213587
33@aggroed6146.6172617.788764.3973043459.5321296177.6134339637.1452434
34@roelandp7849.796705.7888555.5843886778.109349466.3894236244.4982766
35@bukio898.0847361.3148259.398444680.5893644909.2254089589.81460
36@good-karma5156.833066.6268223.4562553372.9261518421.0714071793.9974223
37@cryptopassion3356.1864734.3898090.5751661794.8922344203.8764005998.768141
38@anyx4615.0993462.9088078.0072285137.7461714637.5623999775.3081529
39@steemcommunity4305.3183536.1187841.4362131751.6271750887.0193882638.646662
40@ro-witness6203.1981296.0647499.2623071475.646641738.1773713213.823277
41@holger804417.9232856.1867274.1092187507.4951414223.043601730.535300
42@furion3382.5053850.6317233.1361674826.5151906616.383581442.8951142
43@ura-soul6228.705962.2727190.9773084105.099476463.223560568.319276
44@jesta4815.5462360.7057176.2512384388.1551168888.7833553276.9382988
45@fyrst-witness3352.2983599.2656951.5631659869.9651782153.8213442023.786589
46@teamsteem3792.0083102.8956894.9031877589.3111536379.4143413968.7251890
47@riverhead5335.1851521.1816856.3662641684.109753203.2663394887.3751217
48@busy.witness3746.9443073.2766820.221855276.4961521713.8743376990.372238
49@stem.witness5896.111813.0136709.1242919423.377402558.2333321981.61211
50@xeldal2928.9513277.3176206.2681450252.0041622743.2383072995.2421402
51@ocd-witness5081.0091109.8456190.8542515830.209549533.0113065363.221406
52@justyy4033.4651885.8275919.2921997145.532933755.4932930901.025469
53@guiltyparties3098.3292574.3875672.7161534118.5381274691.7972808810.335569
54@dragosroua4904.983729.9535634.9362428672.01361431.5312790103.541498
55@qurator2652.4352889.695542.1251313336.9651430812.1622744149.127737
56@krnel4504.379811.8745316.2532230315.84401994.5862632310.426298
57@thecryptodrive1971.4273314.4425285.869976139.7551641125.3852617265.141581
58@liondani4864.491348.9845213.4752408622.681172797.4092581420.091177
59@stoodkev2788.962389.2285178.1881380936.4241183011.3772563947.801637
60@ats-witness1956.9953163.5645120.559968993.8541566419.1362535412.99257
61@adsactly-witness3648.2011288.9864937.1871806384.563638233.2862444617.8491138
62@netuoso3591.3551227.6394818.9941778237.516607858.0132386095.5291505
63@partiko2073.1072423.4274496.5341026486.1471199945.232226431.377171
64@emrebeyler3800.321376.54176.8211881705.376186421.7722068127.148482
65@nextgencrypto3084.5591040.0644124.6231527300.402514981.4212042281.823895
66@neoxian2335.061663.2713998.3311156190.679823558.4831979749.162608
67@ihashfury1698.1442284.0823982.226840825.4591130949.3681971774.827281
68@rival865.1423024.5133889.655428369.8181497569.0621925938.88487
69@yuriks20003066.706569.9373636.6431518460.752282200.8571800661.609269
70@steemgigs2805.828703.7813509.6091389288.296348473.0761737761.3721006
71@enginewitty2983.983455.1543439.1371477500.642225366.5441702867.186457
72@mahdiyari2853.93455.7253309.6551413106.066225649.2511638755.3171169
73@comedyopenmic1565.3741636.3873201.761775085.382810246.831585332.212394
74@blackwidow888.1822081.9082970.09439777.891030843.7821470621.67285
75@bitrocker20201601.0371325.8072926.844792743.851656465.4161449209.267284
76@lux-witness2335.351382.5922717.9431156334.88189438.2151345773.095131
77@klye2446.80287.8022534.6041211519.03243474.8351254993.867523
78@delegate.lafona2083.162293.9442377.1061031465.021145544.4941177009.515386
79@markangeltrueman1635.131704.7172339.848809624.994348936.5151158561.509136
80@noisy.witness1810.993277.8372088.83896702.08137569.191034271.27293
81@steemcreative1011.498935.3271946.825500836.791463121.493963958.28472
82@blockchained624.571179.5491804.119309252.2584046.295893298.495127
83@liberosist1782.42114.3551796.776882554.8737107.967889662.84338
84@steemed1731.85931.5661763.425857519.19715629.638873148.835913
85@ayogom1444.312256.1131700.425715142.417126812.606841955.02377
86@joseph1449.708100.7771550.485717813.78649899.133767712.919450
87@demotruk923.306514.181437.486457169.419254593.093711762.51221
88@danielsaori563.947819.1911383.138279235.062405617.592684852.654182
89@felixxx537.226707.9781245.204266004.015350550.951616554.966189
90@chitty935.20832.7967.908463062.48116191.068479253.549134
91@jerrybanfield855.31624.254879.57423504.31912009.201435513.521297
92@fbslo742.6444.788787.428367713.80322176.374389890.177110
93@b0y2k755.52324.673780.196374092.63812216.671386309.309107
94@fubar-bdhr149.421474.916624.33773985.117235151.953309137.078
95@aizensou341.808110.949452.757169244.11854935.564224179.682299
96@complexring344.257100.674444.931170456.94449848.178220305.12268
97@charlieshrem348.24138.289386.53172429.50918958.757191388.266179
98@boatymcboatface217.304128.653345.957107596.87163701.961171298.83251
99@ety001133.933103.955237.88866316.02251472.722117788.74434
100@steemychicken188.3176.02694.34343729.7192983.49246713.211101

Data here was extracted by me using @steemsql from @arcange



So there we have it - Some interesting results there, for sure! Let us know your comments below.

Wishing you well,
Ura Soul


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It is obviously very skewed as currently there is no point in revoting and I see that all the freedom votes that changed lead the chart as always.

It is an interesting comparison. Obviously, there soon will pop up bots that just revote to ensure your votes stay active. And with active key being used for voting that might expose some users to bad services that requests active authority :/

I have to agree that the lists above are super skewed due to the "no need for revote currently". I don't think the actual lists would end up looking anything like this (and it's actually very hard to predict what it would look like, but if I had to make a guess, it would be "not much different from what it is now"). The wild card would be if big stake voters decided to review their votes during such a period (and here I'm referring to your revoting mechansim which I think would be more palatable to voters) and made changes they wouldn't otherwise make.

I did say in the post that:

The actual end result would be somewhere in between the tables below and the current witness ranking tables visible on steemit.com and elsewhere.

I could produce a list that is somewhere in between these lists and the current live data list - but for me the lists on this page are still valid as they show who are the 'movers' in the list, to an extent. I fully agree that the end result would be hard to predict if pushed to the live network.

I'm not sure what you meant by 'no point in revoting' here.
Since the point of witness voting is supposed to be to vote for witnesses who serve the community, you might say that those who choose to get 'someone' to vote for them using a bot gets what they deserve!

I mean that many votes that in a system with decay would revote are not revoting right now. Like my witness votes are to some extend static because I still think these witnesses do a good job. In a real decay system I would have revoted. So this stat shows change not how it would look with decay. That was what I wanted to say :)

Ah ok - Yes, I appreciate that.. I did mention in the post that the actual outcome in real life would be somewhere in between my tables and the current tables used in Steem's live data. I have thought about producing a projection of that too - I might do it if I get time soon.

Regarding the bots. Imo the decay would be bad UX and many people would just stop caring about votes, giving the big stakeholders more power. So it might be a great idea and it might not. Only one way to find out ;)

I think it comes down to how the UX is designed and how reminders work. If people know the necessity of having good votes (and if they don't have to do it too often - maybe annually) - then it should be ok.. It might drive posting campaigns to inform people and that should be a good thing too.

I think that we can all understand the concerns that many people may have when it comes to a decaying (fixed term vote.

However there are some things that are rather important which need to be addressed, they are:

The fact that many of the votes cast are people who have not been active on Steem for periods of well over six months (some even over 12 months).

Which is very disturbing and if we take into consideration the fact that with over a million accounts on Steem with lets say some one hundred thousand being active, that suggests that once we have lets say one million users, these votes could actually play a crucial role in more way than one.

Firstly there is the fact that one hundred thousand to a million non active user votes could immensely affect the overall votes, but there is another thing that I find disturbing and I shall try to express it here in a few sentences.

When a person enters the voting room (page) and sees for example many thousands of user account votes on a certain witness is gives the impression that this witness is supported by "x" amount of voters.

While in actual fact there is no way of knowing how many of those users are actually still here.

Hence the presentation factor that misleads voters and gives out not only misleading information upon which many may cast their votes by, but also the fact that once people find out the truth about these numbers, they shall definitely not feel comfortable about it.
Hence adding to the overall apathy towards voting.

If we are thinking long term, then this does need to be addressed and taken care of.

Again, I say this with only the best of intentions for everyone, for all our fellow Steemians and our Steem blockchain.

I am sure that when we take this into account, we can all agree upon the issue I mentioned as being more than important for the overall good and future of Steem.

I think one could do something like: If your witness votes have not changed for 6 months then delete all of them. That way normal users who change their votes and maintain them keep them and dead accounts are removed over time. Without it affecting user experience as much as a decay.

I think it's a better mechanism. It's actually very similar to one that was suggested for pruning "dead DNS names" in the BitShares DNS DAC plans. In that system, users could bid for DNS names, but they would have to "renew" them yearly to keep DNS names from being permanently lost from the usable namespace due to lost keys, dead users, etc.

Excellent thought and definitely one that could and should be looked at.

I am sure that we have many options out there and definitely we shall find a way to cover the topics/issues at hand.

I dare suggest something along the lines of what you suggested here, and go one step further.

If a user account has had zero transactions on the blockchain that all their stats get reset to zero, ie:

witness votes,
Following,
bandwidth (oops, RC).....

I am sure that we could look at this as an option that could benefit the blockchain and our overall governance in many positive ways.

& love the fact that you threw that suggestion out, it adds an entire new array of options when considering what to do to make things right in all areas along our path to making Steem the best it can be!

@reggaemuffin, just thinking out aloud here:

The trigger could be the yearly anniversary of a user.
So once every 365 days this is triggered for each user.

If a user has their witness vote proxied, the command would be to skip that user. (not do anything)

If it isn't proxied, then the user account is searched and if zero transactions have taken place on the blockchain the following could get set to "0" (nulled)

witness votes
following
RC

and can only be reactivated by adding SP.

Win/Win/Win for everyone and ALL stats on the blockchain are up to date.

= & no disruptions to any active user!

What do you think?

Ok yes, that idea is a good one @reggaemuffin.. Achieving the aim of decay with less potential for annoyance. There can just be a notification that points to a page about why it's important to monitor witnesses and educates about witnesses.. Plus maybe a button to click to confirm you want to keep your witnesses the same and to renew them all for convenience.

I think the potential benefits have been well fleshed out below, so I’ll note one difficulty it would introduce.

Those of you who are witnesses can better speak to this, but wouldn’t fluctuating witness positions in the top 20 decrease reliability? It seems you need a lot more robust equipment and maintenance when you’re processing the volume and constancy of tx as #2 than as #30 or eve as #15. You also have to structure your life around the FT job of being a witness if you’re #2. You don’t as #21.

Is it really reasonable to expect people to do this when they’re fluctuating so much within every 3 month period? ( I use 3 mints because that’s the difference in the two charts you show.)

I do like the idea of weeding out inactive voters though. Maybe you don’t have to keep voting on new witnesses, but your votes for witness only count if you’ve been using RCs within the last 180 days.

As i understand, the steem blockchain is designed to handle failure of this kind, such that if top witnesses (or any witnesses) fail to process blocks significantly then others automatically make up the slack. If the top ones have much better equipment than others it is to some extent because they can afford to have better equipment as a result of being in that position. The fear that allowing others to switch into that position will result in collapse is akin to the logic used to keep dictators in place. I am not saying that the top 20 witnesses are dictators by any means - but there is absolutely no point in having a voting system if the people participating in the vote are never allowed to progress because they haven't already progressed!

In terms of the actual processing requirement, it would be a fairly straightforward thing to upgrade to new, faster hardware if that was necessary after moving up the list to process more blocks.

But if you kept moving up and down, you would not consistently have funds to invest. You might not feel you can afford say a new $10k piece of equipment (wild guess on amount) if you may make $5k this month, then only $500 the next 6 months, before making $5k again. But if you knew things were a bit more stable, you could reasonably invest for the future.

That's not saying that longterm planning leads to keeping dictators in place. We don't vote for president every month either. Presumably the 4 year term is not a dictatorship.

There is something to be said for giving change some pacing, and allowing for stability. I think what we're debating is more what kind of timeframe is that? How tight? How loose?

As far as I am aware there is no need to have anywhere near that level of hardware investment to process the blocks needed to be a top 20 witness. Currently only one server can be used to fulfill the role of a witness at a time and therefore there is a practical limit to how much money can be spent on one (rental). It generally makes much more sense to rent hardware than it does to buy it for such purposes and with things as they are (I am open to being corrected) it should be possible for medium to high end standard servers to handle the task at such throughputs. It is possible to rent such hardware at prices that are well within the reach of many if they want to get started in that role.

I previously explained a concept of altering the reward curve for witnesses that would potentially make any challenges here easier to process:

https://steemit.com/steem/@ura-soul/can-we-improve-steem-s-future-by-re-distributing-witness-rewards

Voter decay is a good idea and was implemented in EOS... this will increase more activity of all block producers. 😀

Absolutely!

Voting decay is really needed not only in STEEM, but Bitshares also!

Best Regards,
Mysteor Team

I know there are strong arguments either way for Voter Decay, it's certainly a tricky subject especially when you consider big investors.

I'm impressed with the tables though, it's interesting to see how they have changed when you take into account vote decay.

Check out reggaemuffin's idea for basing the vote expiry on witness vote activity as a whole, rather than individuals votes - I think it bridges the annoyance gap. ;)

That would so mix up things.. And be way better for the community!

It would probably force newer, popular witnesses into a steep learning curve to fix their servers quickly and would mean that the top 20 might change more often - but yes, that would theoretically be a good thing. I think other changes are needed to keep the balance of this though, I will post about that soon.

The fact that you are putting information out there in a way that may not have been considered before is absolutely fantastic.

The dynamics of this place are far too great to ignore any of the relevant stats out there and anything that gets people thinking in a proactive and open minded manner is definitely worth the effort.

I am sure that many of these figures will change in the next six months, hence proving the daily changes that go on here in all fields of this endeavour.

Big thumbs up.

Thanks Jack, I'm looking currently at how to best integrate this data into Steem Ocean to make it a list that can be checked at will. I also now have what I need to do a great deal of things via code on Steem - including building entire UIs and I have a business plan for one mostly finished from months ago... So expect more soon!

Btw, I have a spare witness vote and will gladly drop it your way - I notice you are voting for asbear, who hasn't upgraded since before HF20, so if you would support me too in our quest to improve things here it would be much appreciated.

tbh I'm not sure what is up with asbear, I am actually waiting to hear it from him directly, so that I don't do anything based upon 'appearance only'.

I respect all his efforts to date here on Steem, especially in the Korean community and a lot more than just that, but his efforts there have helped make it one of the most vibrant and high speed communities adding value to our blockchain.

I do support you in more than one way, you probably know that and I often recommend your name in private chats, simply because I like the way you think and work at things from different angles. Not to mention the obvious, your dedication to this endeavour as a whole.

So nhf, I won't be doing any changes tomy witness votes any time soon, just recently my wife (as per my recommendation) agreed to vote for lower ranking witnesses and gave the OK for me to use our family savings account here to vote on lower ranking witnesses. As a show of consolidation and support to diversity among people in the witness scene. Which is kinda in line with what we are talking about here too.

Rest assured, when I get that opportunity to throw a vote your way it will be there and it won't be disrupting my campaign in any way.

Call me "old school", but I hate unvoting someone unless it is really necessary, I always want to give a person the extra chance, the opportunity to fix whatever it is that would be a reason to unvote them. We are all humans and we all have personal issues (LIFE) so maybe I'm just too soft from that angle when it comes to business here.

Ok fair enough - no problem.

My guess:
Nothing will change.
In 6 months the T20 will look the same, maybe max 3 new ones.

Everything that can be done to clean things up and keep the system balanced should be done!

I was talking in reference to the lists above.
As for the Top20, sure, as long as things stay the way they are, not much shall change. Fully agree with you on that.

Likewise, one of the big issues that needs to be mentioned is "dead voters".

Although their SP (MV) may be 'minute' but it does add up and their votes add to the overall stats in which the overall number of voters voting on certain witnesses is literally misleading and gives voters a false impression.

There are literally thousands of vote cast by people who have not had any transactions what so ever on the blockchain in over six months.

These figures are disturbing and literally they alone present enough justification from all angles of it to introduce a decaying (fixed term) vote.

I voiced my concerns and I dropped from #91 to #152 now.
That tells me everything..

There should be no reason for anyone to get disturbed about an open minded conversation on topics such as the goods and bads of a 'decaying' (fixed term) vote.

It is all in the best interests of making Steem become everything it can be, no matter what arguments or logical conclusions get presented along the way.

I follow many a conversation on Github, in which I personally feel as if I would get ignored by many of the 'longer standing contributors', but none the less I do read and follow what is being said, when it interests me. Again, my bad for not getting involved directly, because I am sure that every contribution can be looked upon in a positive way as long as the persons goals are to make Steem become the dream.

Interesting. I like your idea.

Just thinking out loud.

  • Wouldn't it be great if a limit was placed on how much each vote's worth could be? That way, @freedom wouldn't get to choose our top witnesses.
    • Can you imagine if in real world politics your vote was meaningless because the rich voters had more power? People would rebel.
      • I understand there needs to be a balance of power. Larger stakeholders have more at stake, so perhaps their vote should be worth more. Maybe a balance of power could be devised, similar to what the United States tried to do with having Congressmen and Senators. Congressmen represent the people and in theory Senators represent the many states (stakeholders).

Well, there is a contradiction there in that you are saying that in offline politics people would rebel because they see themselves as democratically equal, but you recognise that those with more money should have more say.. We can't have it both ways! ;)

My idea is that rather than limiting the amount of worth each vote can have, we simply limit the amount of witnesses that each account can vote for - down to maybe 9 or 5.

The problems in real world politics are too numerous to go into. haha

I like both your ideas.

  • Being able to vote for 30 allows a few huge accounts to control all top 20 witnesses. Limiting the number they can vote for would certainly be a step in the right direction. At least then, the majority of users might actually have a say in the other witnesses. That is needed.
  • I also like your idea of vote decay. Some of the scenarios you tossed out could already have happened. (A whale moves on and his witness vote lasts forever...)Here in the states, we tend to vote back in most incumbents. Once politicians get elected, it seems near impossible to replace them.

Congressmen and Senators

Senators are Congressmen, by the by. As for your suggestion for a vote cap: unless that cap was sufficiently low such that major stakeholders were in competition with much smaller shareholders, I don't see how it would make much of a difference. Additionally, many of these high power votes come via proxy, which compounds the voting power of a number of users to boost the overall weight of the vote.

I think decaying votes is the most straightforward solution to addressing the problem of witness voters not renewing their votes and then dropping off somewhere. While the entrenched witnesses may still end up there, it at least encourages a refreshing of everything from time to time.

Go take a look at @reggaemuffin 's comment/suggestion below, ref:

https://steemit.com/steem/@ura-soul/the-most-voted-witness-in-the-last-3-and-6-months-this-is-what-witness-vote-expiry-decay-would-look-like-kinda#@reggaemuffin/re-jackmiller-re-reggaemuffin-re-ura-soul-re-reggaemuffin-re-ura-soul-the-most-voted-witness-in-the-last-3-and-6-months-this-is-what-witness-vote-expiry-decay-would-look-like-kinda-20181006t120630520z

and my response to it.

This line of thought that he brought up could actually be an answer to many things, including but not limited to:

dead voters (& in turn dead followers)

  • RC's that are just sitting there and not being used!

;)

Table is broken on steemit :/

Steampeak:

thanks, yes, I did mention that in the post - steemit doesn't add a scrollbar to wider tables. steempeak does for me on my laptop, so i can see the whole table. I recommend using steempeak to view this post (and in general).

Witness vote expiry is a great idea. Votes last for a fixed period, e.g. a year.
I don't know if vote decay would be better. I assume we are talking about something like depreciation over time (linear/exponential).
Expiry sounds more intuitive and practical to me.

Decay in this instance refers to immediate decay, so the same as expiry.

I’m going to have to look at this once I’m on desktop cause Partiko just shows me a jumble of data. Interesting idea.

Posted using Partiko iOS

I don't have iOS to test partiko out here.. However, the format of this post is based on standard markdown based tables, so I think there is a bug in partiko.

I certainly haven't visited all of their pages, but it seems that the top 21 in these lists are certainly deserving of their rank. The pages of those that I have visited are quite active and tend to provide a wealth of value to the community. Still, I do think that a decay system would be valuable--kinda surprised that the designers of the platform hadn't included something like that as base functionality. Knowing that you've gotta keep working to earn those votes would certainly serve to keep the top performers performing.